Eudaimoniaq and Rutt

Two podcast appearances from different places land in the same spot, conversationally

I punched out two podcasts over the last month, and both seemed to hold the same underlying theme despite being from hosts of different flavors in different locations. Salvatore (From the Lotus World / Eudaimoniaq) is a relatively obscure relatively young Portuguese guy who seems to be pulling some good thinkers onto his platform. Jim Rutt is a relatively well known relatively older Silicon Valley expat. Both of these podcasts were based on different bundles of HWFO material, but both seemed to fall into the discussion of the efficacy of religion as a beneficial societal control mechanism. The Rutt one in particular (second link) ended up being more me interviewing him, trying to hold his hand and kite a staunch atheist to admit the value of religion.

Listen to the first podcast here:

#17 - BJ Campbell: media narratives, societal beliefs and depopulation

Or here:

ChatGPT had this to say:

Key Themes Discussed:

1. Media Narratives and Tribalism: Campbell explores how media outlets often craft narratives that align with the biases of their social groups. This tendency reinforces tribal divisions and can lead to the suppression of dissenting viewpoints, even within scientific communities.​

2. Civilizational Identity Crisis: The conversation delves into the idea that society is experiencing an identity crisis, where traditional values and beliefs are being challenged, leading to uncertainty and fragmentation.​

3. Balance Between Order and Freedom: The podcast examines the tension between maintaining societal order and preserving individual freedoms, discussing how policies and governance can impact this balance.​

4. Role of Religion: Campbell and Salvador discuss how religious beliefs influence individuals' lives and societal structures, considering both positive and negative aspects.​

5. Implications of Depopulation: The episode also touches on the potential consequences of a declining population, including economic and social impacts.​

Throughout the episode, Campbell emphasizes the importance of recognizing and critically evaluating the narratives presented by media and other institutions, advocating for a more nuanced understanding of complex societal issues.

In this episode, BJ Campbell discusses how media constructs narratives that reflect and reinforce tribal identities, often sidelining objectivity. He addresses the "civilizational identity crisis," where conflicting values erode collective cohesion. The conversation explores the delicate tradeoff between societal order and individual liberty, the shifting role of religion as both stabilizer and divider, and the socio-political implications of global depopulation trends. The episode also touches on institutional decay, scientific dogma, and emergent belief systems.

And listen to the second podcast here:

The Rutt conversation was also around an hour and centered around the core argument from this article from a year ago:

ChatGPT had this to say about it:

The podcast episode from The Jim Rutt Show featuring BJ Campbell centers on the themes of social control, belief systems, and societal organization, inspired by Campbell's Substack essay, "On Cops, Belief, and Chainsaw Faced Robot Dogs." Key topics discussed include:

• Social Control and Belief Systems: Campbell proposes a thought experiment contrasting an absolute police state (with extreme enforcement mechanisms like "chainsaw-faced robot dogs") and a belief-driven state where order is maintained through fear or faith in enforcement rather than actual enforcement. This highlights the role of belief in maintaining societal order.

• The Concept of the Noble Lie: Drawing from Plato's Republic, the discussion explores the idea that certain falsehoods can be justified if they promote social stability. Examples include religion, nationalism, and even money as socially constructed "noble lies."

• 2020 Crime Spike and Policing: The hosts examine the relationship between the "defund the police" movement, reduced police morale, and increased crime rates. They argue that both belief in law enforcement and effective policing are necessary to maintain order.

• Religion and Social Cohesion: The conversation delves into how religious belief systems historically provided societal coherence. They discuss whether secular societies can achieve similar cohesion without relying on supernatural beliefs or noble lies.

• Game B and Future Societal Models: Jim Rutt introduces "Game B," a vision for a new societal framework emphasizing voluntary cooperation, high trust, and decentralized organization. He suggests this model could replace current systems reliant on noble lies.

Overall, the episode blends philosophical inquiry with practical observations about governance, belief, and societal evolution.

The fact that these podcasts bent the same direction over time indicates to me there is a kind of strange attractor going on in the rationalist space towards religion as a solution to societal coordination problems, which has been a basis of HWFO writing for half a decade. It’s possible other people are finally starting to get it, or else whatever qualifies as a Rationalist Egregore is pivoting over towards it.